Sunday, August 29, 2010

HOPE ON A SLIDING SCALE

OK, all the hard righties have been telling us for years that WJC and BHO were just toying with out emotions and manipulating us when they talked about "hope" as a basis for their respective theories of governance.  I kind of get that.  All the USA is supposed to offer us is the pursuit of happiness.  Whether and how we get to happiness is kind of up to us.  That's cool.  I buy into that argument.

So why is the same sappy use of "Hope" to support a theory of governance by Glenn Beck not as objectionable?  We all heard it yesterday.

Geese and Ganders, kiddies.  Geese and Ganders.

17 Comments:

At 6:33 AM, August 29, 2010, Anonymous Anonymous said...

SWOOSH. That's the sound of what took place yesterday going right over your head. We'll see you and Phil Hare in November.

 
At 7:41 AM, August 29, 2010, Blogger TOOKIE said...

Lets see , code pink rallies ..... scratch that . Rallies outside the G20 summit .....double scratch . Rallies outside the RNC convention ....

Your Dem team is like the Cubs in October . I know it infuriates folks to no end but a vast amount of people woke up and don't like the way things are .

We have local Government run amok . We have States that are flat out broke and their only option is more jobs killing economic paths.

We have a federal government so out of touch with the American people .

So does taking minor pop shots at these people change their mind ? I think the exact opposite happens they multiply .

 
At 8:53 AM, August 29, 2010, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Several online tests I've taken put me exactly in the middle, though "hard lefties" seem certain I am "hard right".

Beck was pushing individual salvation ... personal accountability. This is in opposition to the left's "collective salvation", apparently gained through wealth redistribution enforced by government.

I didn't hear about "Hope" as a theory of governance, only that our leaders should be able to acknowledge "one nation under God" as a personal belief. He shows most founders had deep Christian convictions.

BHO wants to expand our constitution to state not just what government cannot do to us, but what government "MUST do on your behalf". The "hope" of redistributive change enforced by government is part of Obama's dream. And he seems to want to spread our wealth around the world, not just here.

The more self reliant want constrained government that will allow them to succeed on their own. Obama's hope is to become more Chavez like, where government is the supreme being that provides jobs and homes and unicorns.

His pal Chavez made a lot of promises, and Obama's road to ruin is exemplified in the recent history of that country.

Conservatives will have to run with specific plans to prevent the Obama/Chavez Orwellian plan from materializing here. Beck is selling books and his web site, not running for office. Exposing Obama has gotten him a lot of attention.

Many conservatives cringe at Beck's sappiness at times, but he has removed some scales from some that were living in Obama dreamland. Americans are known to have trust/hope in God/themselves, not Hope in their government providing for them.

Those two philosophies are not birds of a feather ... they are polar opposites. I think we fight wars over those issues.

bill

 
At 11:39 AM, August 29, 2010, Blogger UMRBlog said...

0633,

Atta Boy! You know stuff nobody else knows and you can decrypt all those swell nmessages on your secret decoder ring.

Let me simplify this for you. Righties say BHO talking about "Hope" was unfair or deceptive. I was just holding Brother Beck to the same standard.

You see? You don't have to deal with any secret squirrel shit to join issue on my point. If you choose not to, that's certainly your call. Happy super-secret insight. Enjoy.

 
At 11:42 AM, August 29, 2010, Blogger UMRBlog said...

Took,

Simple point: "Hope" is either a fair argument or it isn't.

BTW, Local Gov't isn't by any means run amok. Reduced budget and reduced payroll. Standstill agreements on the CBA side. Sounds pretty responsible to me.

I realize you are giving your view from 30,000 feet but I'm not arguing that. I'm contesting the double standard your own peeps have applied to two different gifted speaker for the use of the same term/concept.

TYFCB

 
At 11:44 AM, August 29, 2010, Blogger UMRBlog said...

Oh, Took,

I agree State Gov't is FUBAR and the Federal Gov't doesn't understand as much about my life or those of my children as they do a displaced Palestinian.

 
At 11:47 AM, August 29, 2010, Blogger TOOKIE said...

Local run amok examples .

Fire engines

Hydro

Train staining / Space port ( whatever it is )

Ole Sparky has been busy but .....much is just a band aid on a femoral artery wound . Chucky B and Spring are out of touch . I won't get into the public employees acting like a "girls gone wild" dvd ....... but

 
At 11:50 AM, August 29, 2010, Blogger UMRBlog said...

Bill,

OK, great. You're a centrist.

"Accountablility" to whom?

I love to think about Chaim Solomon when you revisionists talk about how the founding fathers where "Christian."

Anyhow, back to my basic point...identical messages: "Follow me if you want to achieve 'hope'" It was noxious and dishonest coming from Obama and it's just peachy coming from Beck. That's just intellectually dishonest.

BTW, I may agree with you more than you know about some of the redistributive stuff and even the turd of a health care plan that passed earlier this year.

TYFCB

 
At 12:07 PM, August 29, 2010, Anonymous Freddy said...

Don't get all bent out of shape. Let me simplify this for you. BHO was selling himself as Hope. Beck said to put your hope in yourself and god. Get it? It's not secret, you just hear what you want to hear.

 
At 12:21 PM, August 29, 2010, Blogger UMRBlog said...

Freddy Boy,

Here's the problem with your argument. I didn't make up the term "Hope". Beck said it and, just like, Obama, said "we" had to this and that to achieve "hope".

All you're giving me is a dressed up version of "I like Beck's and I didn't like BHO's." That's a playground argument.

I'd say "lipstick on a pig" but that's so trite. So I'll just say your argument doesn't meet my "Ideological Requirements".

TYFCB.

 
At 12:25 PM, August 29, 2010, Blogger UMRBlog said...

Took, 1147

Wildy disagree with you on the fire engines. It was a wise and conservative purchase.

Hydro is a question of physics and I don't have the answers. It's hard to say the study stage was a mistake. Everything bold that may not play out is not reckless.

I never had anything to do with the whole Intermodal thing so I don't know if it's a boondoggle or a great idea. You and I should have that discussion some day.

Personal conduct of public servants off duty is a tough one to discuss in policy terms. No matter what our fiscal policies are, we'll always be dealing with human behavior. That's why we have an HR department.

TYFCB

 
At 12:35 PM, August 29, 2010, Anonymous Freddy said...

It was a reppudiation of BHO's insistence that people put their hope in him. You're right. It's the same word , but it's different. I'll let your readers decide.

 
At 12:39 PM, August 29, 2010, Blogger UMRBlog said...

Freddy,

Event though you put an extra "p" in "repudiation", I found that your comment met my "Ideological Requirements" so it is posted above.

Thanks for adding to a fun discussion. Maybe simple blogging isn't dead yet.

 
At 12:41 PM, August 29, 2010, Anonymous Freddy said...

Ditto on the "Event" in your last.

 
At 12:47 PM, August 29, 2010, Blogger UMRBlog said...

Freddy,

I'll "Event"ually get it right.

TYFCB

 
At 3:56 PM, August 29, 2010, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Simpleton blogging is overrated ... isn't that what twitter is for?

Obama ran on incredible hope/promises as people ignored his socialist "New Party" past, and his Rev. Wright black theology.

Beck is not a candidate, and his "self reliance" is not hope, it is saying "No" to the Obama false promises and dependence on government.

Saying "No" to socialism/communism does not require governing on the basis of JC returning, but it IS harder to get people dependent on government when they depend on God and themselves. Christians have that stubborn tendency to resist submission and slavery.

Beck's "Faith HOPE Charity", is of course, just a Biblical reference. Christians hope for "the return of JC" and a perfect future world.

Obama was promising hope/heaven on earth via government and "collective salvation".

***

Not sure why Solomon negates the idea the founders were mostly Christian. I used to buy the (revisionist?) argument that many were actually "deists", or assorted beliefs, but now am mostly convinced they were pretty firm Bible believers. Beck has had several historians covering that topic.

Bill

 
At 8:41 AM, September 03, 2010, Blogger UMRBlog said...

Bill,

Intelligent arguments made pretty well. I invoke Chaim Solomon (probably the founder who gave up the most...his life was basically destroyed.) whenever anybody says "USA is a Christian Nation" or even rubs up against saying it.

I don't make the "Deist" argument, ever, because it's presumptuous.

TYFCB

 

Post a Comment

Links to this post:

Create a Link

<< Home