GIVE IT A REST: JEREMIAH'S NO BULLFROG
I don't know who is pushing this attack on Chicago Pastor Jeremiah Wright (Besides creepy Sean Hannity--I'm talking about real people not Murdoch paid hitters) but it's pretty much wrong headed.
What's wrong with anything Wright has said? Hillary, in fact, doesn't know what it's like to be a black youngster with a single mom and Dad down the road. If Pastor Wright thinks Jesus is a fair comparison to BObama, that's his constitutionally protected opinion. He's proud of his guy. What's wrong with that?
And what Wright praised Minister Farakhan for? Holding young black men personally responsible for their conduct. Who disagrees with that?
Experts can argue about whether Wright is helpful to Obama or not. That's a different conversation than whether Wright is a racist or separatist. It is said that his philosophy is "Afrocentric". Hey, who's in his congregation? Is he supposed to do his worship service in Spanish? C'mon, people, the guy is ministering to the folks who show up seeking his spiritual guidance.
Finally, do we want to make all candidates responsible for everything their pastors say?
Let's be reasonable. BObama stands or falls on his own merits. Get off his Pastor's case.
posted by UMRBlog @ 06:57
22 comments
22 Comments:
Barack Obama is on the record, in word and deed, that Jeremiah Wright, Jr. is an important man to him. It is documented, in the words of Jeremiah Wright himself, just how radical this very important man is.
This is important to understand Obama's real politics.
Should Obama gain the Democratic nomination, Wright's role as the man who shaped Obama -- as attested to by Obama himself -- is certain to become a major point of discussion, as it has been in the conservative blogosphere and talk radio, but is now coming into widespread discussion. It is hard to keep a colorful character like Jeremiah Wright, Jr. under wraps, no matter how desperately Obama and much of the media want to keep him out of discussion.
Barack Obama exposes his daughters to the rants of Pastor Wright. How is that for judgment and responsibility? He is their spiritual teacher.
Perhaps he says to his children, "Well, don't believe everything he says...."
What kind of message would that send them?
0848,
I'll give you this much: It is legitimate to use Wright to fill in blanks where Obama leaves them. As long as Obama gets around to stating what he stands for, there are no blanks.
And, yeah, the tone of his voice when he discusses "Rich White Folks.." is not going to be helpful in Indiana or Pennsylvania.
Being an active member and significant benefactor of such a church for 20 years is by natural extension an endorsement of the pastor's message. With one of these churches, if you do not buy into the pastor's specific direction, you go to another church. It is not at all like going to your family's 3rd generation Methodist Church and having varying degrees of agreements with the numerous pastors as they flowed through the pulpit.
Who among us hasn't taken the kids to church and heard the Pastor say something wacky? Who among us hasn't used that occasion to talk to the kids about why we respectfully disagree with the Pastor and here's why, biblically and morally.
Wacky Pastor blurts are a great opportunity for parents to teach.
I'm not ready to call DCFS on the Obamas because of their choice of church.
As you know, I support the other candidate but I want no part of this argument against Obama.
TYFCB with an interesting point of view.
0928,
Let's assume you're right (I disagree and you can find plenty of evidence of stability irrespective of Pastoral thought right here in Quincy) and his devotion to his church is evidence of his PERSONAL philosophy. What would that have to do with his approach to governance?
Isn't this just the Anti-JFK/Romney argument warmed over and touched up with racial fear/distrust?
As I said earlier, I don't support the guy but I think it's inappropriate to use his church's doctrine as an argument against his candidacy. Plus, I'm not sure Wright has said anything wrong anyhow.
TYFCB and for making a cogent argument as well as it can be made.
Barack Obama sought out the message of Jeremiah Wright, joined and remained in and supported TUCC because of that message, and in fact named his book after a sermon of that message. He even used that message so that black voters in Chicago would not focus on the half of Obama that is white, and on his privileged Hawaiian education. To paraphrase the good pastor, he "was riding dirty" on that message.
I must wonder, however, how this got past Clinton, Inc, for so long. Maybe it's just me, but since we've been told that white Iowans and so on loved the non-threatening post racial nature of Obama....I can't help but think that a little Jerry Wright sprinkled in early and often might have nipped this hoax in the bud. Just a thought.
0947,
Perhaps smart people in the Clinton campaign realized that the religion/pastor argument is always a political loser.
Folks will always find their own way back to their pet prejudices.
0943,
I think anyone would maintain a soft spot for the person who led him to Christ.
Writers and public speakers pick up inspirational material where they find it.
White people don't focus on the half of somebody who is white either.
On the privileged schooling, everybody in Chicago understands the concept of magnet schooling. There was nothing for him to hide there.
TYFCB
If we give Obama a pass on Wright and Farrakhan, does that mean the Democrats will give McCain a pass on Parsley and Hagee?
Or is religious tolerance only accorded to Democrats?
Just askin'.
If all pastors agreed on everything there would only be one religion. Reverend Wright is supporting his 20 year parisioner the best way he knows how. And whether anyone likes it or not, Bush and Cheney are rich white men. Bill Clinton is a rich white man. On the whole, I'd rather be a rich white man than a poor balck man.
QCE,
The argument for McCain is stronger. These guys are just outliers. They are not his pastors.
Hagee, particularly, is not my cup of tea but I don't hold JM responsible for any of Hagee's doctrinal crap.
Have you actually heard the clips of what this man speaking? I have. This is not just your run of the mill fire and brimstone Black preacher. No - It is some of this most rabid, vitriolic, America-hating...hate speech I have heard. He is way way off the charts. If this guy is Obama's "spiritual advisor" or part of his inner circle, it is a scary thought indeed.
Perhaps smart people in the Clinton campaign realized that the religion/pastor argument is always a political loser.
If you think the Clintons had nothing to do with this, you know the rest.
>his devotion to his church is
>evidence of his PERSONAL
>philosophy. What would that have
>to do with his approach to
>governance?
A lot, I hope, or his "devotion" is meaningless.
This whole idea that a candidate shouldn't allow his religious belief to be part of his governing is nonsensical. It's part of who he is as a person, including whatever actions he takes at work, at home, or anywhere else. Or it's not worth bothering to "believe".
Not saying of course that he should impose his beliefs on others, but his beliefs should certainly be part and parcel of the decisions he makes.
Now with regard to Pastor Wright, my impression was that it was his rather overwrought reactions to 9/11 and the things he said in that regard that was the root of the problem.
We damn near crucified Falwell and Robertson for making similar remarks about America "deserving" the death and destruction, and rightly so. Their remarks--and Pastor Wright's--were irresponsible and insulting.
Most of his other pronouncements--well, as UMR says, he gets to have his own opinions and he can pretty much share them as he sees fit.
But of course with freedom comes responsibility. I note that BObama has apparently asked Pastor Wright to step down from his place in the campaign. I also notice that Pastor Wright is man enough not to complain about it too.
I may not agree with Pastor Wright on many things, but he appears to be a man worthy of respect in his willingness to accept responsibility, including for his words years ago.
"Guilt by Association" is not the relevant concept. It's "Agreement by Association" that is.
When intelligent people are serious about their faith, they pick their church home very intentionally and with considerable forethought. When they stay, they do so intentionally, and with commitment. If they don't approve of what they hear from the pulpit, or what they don't hear from the pulpit, they leave, as well they should. There are exceptions, but those are relatively few.
Barack Obama either agreed with what was preached from the Trinity pulpit, or he tuned it out and stayed around pretending to for political reasons. To say he stayed for 20 years but doesn't agree with Wright's preaching is incredible denial. It'd be like a man buying White Sox season tickets for 20 years, attending the games, and saying he's not a fan.
I'll bet if Jerry Fallwell spoke the same words that Jeremiah Wright did and John McClain attened you would have a different position. This guy is a racist pure an simple and Obama is an idiot if he thinks the average American is going to believe he didn't know anything about what his preacher was saying. Total double standard for democracts as usual........alwasy a double standard.....................
Uh, Bushie,
No double standard here. I gave McCain the same pass on his own wacko thumpers.
You really need to do something about anger management.
TYFCB
I'm sorry UMR, but what church did John McCain attend for 20 years where the pastor spewed such racist words from the pulpit??
"I think anyone would maintain a soft spot for the person who led him to Christ."
This is the biggest load of rubbish I have ever heard. Well, maybe not...
"Wacky Pastor blurts are a great opportunity for parents to teach."
Really??!?! This Obama cat is running for President of the United States! And all these stooges are making excuses for this preacher's behavior. Have you heard the clips???? Seen the footage???? I love it....have any of you listened to Obama's responses to this stuff? Have you ever heard more political or scripted responses in your life??? I sure wish he'd go on the Factor, or Hannity and Colmes, and discuss this. What's he afraid of???
Uh, Bill,
He was on H&C, Sunday night.
You seem to be new here. Welcome. Just so you know, this is no Obama apologist site. The Basin is Hillary country. We're just trying to be fair. A man is not universally responsible for stupid stuff his pastor says.
The new stuff that came out last night is pretty tough to take but I hold to the view that BObama's not responsible for the political views of his pastor.
TYFCB. Please come again.
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